Jump to content



Featured Articles

Check out the latest featured articles.

File Library

Check out the latest downloads available in the File Library.

New Article

Product Viscosity vs. Shear

Featured File

Vertical Tank Selection

New Blog Entry

Low Flow in Pipes- posted in Ankur's blog

Pressure Drop/rise In Natural Gas Pipelines

natural gas pipeline compressor pressure thermodynamics design pressure drop

This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
4 replies to this topic
Share this topic:
| More

#1 Aakash12

Aakash12

    Brand New Member

  • Members
  • 2 posts

Posted 03 November 2015 - 10:39 AM

I was recently doing a natural gas pipeline design assignment given to us in college. During the evaluation, I was told that I had made a huge conceptual blunder regarding the pressure drop calculation in the pipeline. I really need your help to verify/correct me in this matter.

 

So, the pipeline spanned 1300km and was meant to have certain amounts of gas delivered mid-way i.e. 10-15% of gas was taken out at 10km, 30km, etc. Now I believe that there will be a pressure drop experienced due to reduction in the gas amount at these positions. (Now if this seems silly to you, believe me, I have been ridiculed endlessly by my professor as well. Please bear with me so that I can understand if and why I was wrong.) 

 

I was under the impression that the gas law (with Z-factor) will still hold (for say, a moving packet of gas) where the pressure will be directly proportional to the mass of gas held in the packet. So, according to my calculations, wherever n2 amount of gas is being taken out of the pipeline with initial amount being n1, P2=(1-n2/n1)P1.

 

I am being told that because it's a continuous pipeline and not a closed box, the gas law isn't valid and the pressure will remain the same and a drop will be experience throughout the pipeline only because of friction or elevation. 

 

Can anyone please help me out and tell me if and why I am wrong? 

If possible, can you please direct me to a webpage where I can understand about this at the most basic level (if needed, in your opinion).

 

Thank you,

Aakash



#2 Art Montemayor

Art Montemayor

    Gold Member

  • Admin
  • 5,780 posts

Posted 03 November 2015 - 02:01 PM

Aakash:

 

If you are telling us the truth about your prof ridiculing you because of a misconception on your part regarding fluid flow, then you, unfortunately, have a bad teacher.  No student should be ridiculed about having a lack of knowledge or proper prior teachings.  A student, by definition, is supposed to be ignorant and lacking in knowledge.  That is why he is in school: to obtain that knowledge.  Instead of making fun of your ignorance on the subject, the prof should make it his/her job to teach you where you are going wrong and how to remedy your lack of knowledge on the subject.  That is what the prof is being paid to do.

 

By being candid and admitting your lack of knowledge, you have come to the right place.  This is why Chris Haslego started this Student Forum in order to concentrate specifically on student problems.  Here, you will receive some advice and key learnings from experienced engineers who have gone through the same learning cycle.

 

You are wrong in your concept of fluid flow - but not because “it's a continuous pipeline and not a closed box, the gas law isn't valid and the pressure will remain the same and a drop will be experience throughout the pipeline only because of friction or elevation.”  There is no reason to apply the gas law as you have indicated because, as stated, this is not a static gas problem - although the principles supporting the gas law DO apply to the gas flow because as the gas is reduced in pressure due to pressure drop, it will expand.  Therefore, the compressibility factor does play a role in gas pipeline calculations.  This is where I think you are having difficulty understanding the unit operation of gas flow.  There are many fluid flow texts in existence that explain the principles involving both liquids and gases (gases being the most difficult).

 

All fluid flow - whether liquid or gas - takes place under the influence of a DRIVING FORCE.  Once the fluid flows, it is subjected to a pressure loss as it proceeds downstream in its conduit.  This pressure loss is due to conduit wall friction (as told to you) but also to directional turns, conduit fittings (valves, elbows, Tees, etc.), and fluid turbulence.  It is important to understand this principle and dominate it.  Many students confuse this topic by believing that pumps and compressors are the cause of pressure build-up.  Actually, neither pumps nor compressors create a pressure.  It is THE RESISTANCE that the fluid has to confront and overcome in its flow path that actually causes the original source to develop a pressure.  Without a flow resistance, there would be no pressure drop and consequently no pressure developed at the source.

 

What is definitely important here is your cooperation in fully studying and understanding the basic Darcy Equation for liquid flow.  It is important that you know the basis and the assumptions taken for the development of this equation.  Once you have grasped this, you will be prepared to tackle the more difficult subject of compressible flow.

 

I am confident that some of our experienced engineers will join in this thread with helpful and constructive advice regarding gas flow in pipelines and how to develop the correct relationship regarding pressure drop in a pipeline.  This topic should be of great interest and value to all chemical engineering students because it will not go away after college.  It will continue to be a subject to resolve through your future career.

 

I will be submitting some documents later from personal notes that I have accumulated through the years that may be of interest and help to you.  Right now, I’m on my way out on personal business.



#3 Bobby Strain

Bobby Strain

    Gold Member

  • Members
  • 3,529 posts

Posted 03 November 2015 - 03:27 PM

http://fekete.com/SA...alculations.htm

 

This should help you. But, you must have a textbook for your course.

 

Bobby



#4 breizh

breizh

    Gold Member

  • Admin
  • 6,344 posts

Posted 03 November 2015 - 06:00 PM

Hi ,

To support your work .

Good luck and keep it up !

 

Breizh



#5 Art Montemayor

Art Montemayor

    Gold Member

  • Admin
  • 5,780 posts

Posted 03 November 2015 - 09:03 PM

Aakash:

 

I knew I could rely on our quality senior members to follow through with specific help and positive contributions.  This has been a characteristic of this Student Forum through the years.

 

Attached are some documents you may also want to look at.  Included in one document is a download from our own ChE Resources Website dealing with the topic.  Also included is an Excel workbook from our own Breizh, whose quality of help can be recognized in the quality of his workbook.

 

You and other students reading this thread will have your workdays and weekends all occupied with the study work contributed by Bobby, Breizh, and myself.  But believe me, it will be profitable and rewarding work if you dedicate yourself to studying the material and asking further questions as they come up.  Graduating as a Chemical Engineer was never described as an easy chore or a major study for just anyone.  It will continue to take hard work and dedication to succeed in it.  Chemical Engineering is not for the faint of heart.

 

Good Luck.

Attached File  A Tutorial on Compressible Fluid Pipe Flow Equations.pdf   283.71KB   39 downloads

Attached File  Compressible Gas Flow Calculation.xlsx   123.23KB   50 downloads

Attached File  Compressible Gas Flow Tutorial.docx   68.49KB   23 downloads

Attached File  Isothermal Compressible Gas Pipe Flow.docx   187.34KB   29 downloads






Similar Topics