Jump to content



Featured Articles

Check out the latest featured articles.

File Library

Check out the latest downloads available in the File Library.

New Article

Product Viscosity vs. Shear

Featured File

Vertical Tank Selection

New Blog Entry

Low Flow in Pipes- posted in Ankur's blog

How To Lock Vacuum Evenif Vacuum Devices Gets Fail


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
4 replies to this topic
Share this topic:
| More

#1 Guest_Annee_*

Guest_Annee_*
  • guestGuests

Posted 09 June 2005 - 06:23 AM

Dear All,

For high value product distillation under high vacuum ( App. 5 torr) i have to make a system which should able to hold up the same vacuum evenif vacuum providing devices fails in its operation due to anyreason. As my product has tendency to get polymerised and solidify if anyhow it come in contact with oxygen or vacuum fails. I am going to take this reaction in 6 KL GLR reactor and thinking to get vacuum through its condenser/receiver.

my quieries is :

(1) As in case of VTD( Vacuum tray drier) to hold the vacuum inside the drier (ife our vacuum system fails during drying ) we generally use NRV ( Non return valve) there. can i install the same NRV system in vacuum line connected my condenser/ receviver to ejector, so that evenif vacuum get fails it lock my system & help in holding vacuum in my reactor sysytem and prohibt the entrance of air from inside the reactor.

Whether the above system will work here in the same the way i have described above. Or i think also think to another alternative also

please share urs experiences with me here

waiting for your response

Thanks

-Annee

#2 Art Montemayor

Art Montemayor

    Gold Member

  • Admin
  • 5,782 posts

Posted 09 June 2005 - 01:34 PM

Annee:

I'm having difficulty reading and understanding your English, but I believe I understand your problem. You can't tolerate breaking a vacuum of 5 torr because you run the risk of polymerizing your product should it come into contract with atmospheric Oxygen.

I would not rely on a check valves (or multiple checkvalves) to save my product in case of vacuum failure. Check valves (or "non-return" valves) are notorious for leaking when not expected to. The system I would incorporate - especially if the system involved is relatively small as you indicate - is one where I would bleed in inert Nitrogen gas from a pressurized cylinder. Immediately after injecting the Nitrogen, I would activate a leak-tight, soft-seat, ball valve to block in the process and not admit atmospheric air into the system. This would "lock-in" the inerted product and avoid a polimerization to take place.

Art Montemayor

#3 Guest_Annee_*

Guest_Annee_*
  • guestGuests

Posted 09 June 2005 - 11:31 PM

Sir,
You are right i am talking the same system but still there is more thing. i have one doubt on what you suggested - leak-tight, soft-seat, ball valve to block in the process- to maintain the vacum inside 6 KL- GLR Reactor if my ejector fails to operates,

- the valve you are talking is manually operated or it should be connected with some automatic devices.
- Does it work so fast as the vacuum drop immidately

One more thing you also suggested me to bleed N2 into system to provide inert atms. to avoid any danger of persence of Oxygen there, whose persence in turn can polymerised my product. But sir Under high vacuum definately all Nitogen will be sucked out from system, In that case if ejector fails, how could i able to maintain the high vacuum ( 5 torr, In 6 KL reactor) quickly. Thtas was my main question.

If u have literature on this topic plz provide me.

hope this time you wonn't feel any problem with my english , and reply & guide me with same spirit.

Keenly waiting for your response

Regards

-Annee

#4 Art Montemayor

Art Montemayor

    Gold Member

  • Admin
  • 5,782 posts

Posted 10 June 2005 - 12:07 PM

Annee:

When you experience a vacuum failure in your process equipment you have no time for manual override or controls. It happens spontaneously and you must respond correspondingly. The usual method I use and the description I gave you employs a very sensitive vacuum switch set at a setpoint slightly higher than your operating point. When the vacuum is lost, the switch activates a series of actions:

1) it instantly opens a solenoid valve that is connected to a sufficient Nitrogen source that is stored at a pressure that is designed to not elevate your equipment pressure beyond its MAWP (Maximum Allowable Working Pressure). This action instantly replaces the partial vacuum with a rush of inert nitrogen that sweeps through the equipment and doesn’t allow atmospheric air to invade the equipment due to the vacuum loss.
2) after a reasonable time to allow the nitrogen to sweep through the equipment, the main block valve is actuated and this action seals in the nitrogen inert atmosphere that you have introduced into the equipment. The equipment should be effectively sealed and inerted while the system is shut down and the vacuum failure is investigated and repaired or resolved.

Note that there are various safety precautions and steps that you must study and undertake – as in all process changes – in order to make sure that you have a SAFE and operable operation under this type of instrumentation. You should hold at least 2 Hazops among your operators and engineers prior to installing and operating under this type of instrumented shutdown in order to ensure safety and total agreement among all your operating personnel.

Your question about maintaining a vacuum after failure is not a logical and valid engineering alternative. Once you loose vacuum you are, in effect, totally shut down in your unit. You must resort to finding the cause of the failure and resolving it. The issue at hand is what do you do about the product that is exposed to potential polymerization, and this is taken care of by the introduction of an engineered, inert atmosphere that allows you to safely shut down and proceed with resolving the problem and proceeding to startup again after the resolution is found.

I hope this explains the logic and engineering reasons for the recommended procedures.

#5 Guest_Annee_*

Guest_Annee_*
  • guestGuests

Posted 10 June 2005 - 11:53 PM

Thank you very much for all your supports.

Regards

-Annee




Similar Topics