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Acid Base Extractions


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#1 paradoxlost

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Posted 07 July 2024 - 05:41 PM

Does anyone have a recommendation for modelling acid base extractions of alkaloids from plants? It's been a hobby of mine since college. I just like how I can do the same process to the innumerable plants on this planet and get a result, and than those results can be different based on the different solvents used. I want to model the process with different solvents.

 

 I know its not straight forward due to the unknown chemical environment of most plants, but still, I want to try based on established literature. I also have access to HPLC, GC/MS, IR Spec so I can narrow down the possible carbohydrate/starches/waxes that are in all plants.

 

Right now I'm using GROMACS, but I don't think this is the best software for the job.



#2 shvet1

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Posted 07 July 2024 - 11:24 PM

Modelling of what? An industry scale process?


Edited by shvet1, 07 July 2024 - 11:25 PM.


#3 breizh

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Posted 08 July 2024 - 07:47 AM

Hi,

Google "extraction alkaloid from plants" you will be surprised, tutorials also available on YouTube channel.

https://patents.goog...t/US5684155A/en

Good luck

Breizh



#4 paradoxlost

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Posted 08 July 2024 - 11:13 AM

Modelling of what? An industry scale process?

a kinetics model for a molecular scale, and than i was going to use DWSIM for the industrial scale



#5 paradoxlost

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Posted 08 July 2024 - 11:14 AM

Hi,

Google "extraction alkaloid from plants" you will be surprised, tutorials also available on YouTube channel.

https://patents.goog...t/US5684155A/en

Good luck

Breizh

I know how to do such a process, in fact I hold a patent for a green extraction process myself. I'm just trying to find a way to model it for demostration purposes. Boards of directors tend not to be science literate, but want to be hands on.



#6 shvet1

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Posted 09 July 2024 - 12:11 AM

a kinetics model for a molecular scale, and than i was going to use DWSIM for the industrial scale

 

What for? I was taught that mass transfer kinetic is able to be obtained by lab measurement only. As per my experience with unstudied material a good starting point is the Aspen+ feature "draw molecule" - see zip attached.

 

You believe that obtaining a kinetic provides you some help in modelling of solids processing, correct? 

My idea is whether you will have a kinetic or not this changes nothing in process modelling such kind of. Do you believe one can create a credible model by putting in a flowsheet an extractor block? Or is this model intended for a presentation purpose only to impress the boardmembers and has nothing to do with a future pilot plant?

 

for info

https://www.shi-pe.s...cture/basic008/

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Edited by shvet1, 09 July 2024 - 03:50 AM.


#7 paradoxlost

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Posted 09 July 2024 - 04:57 AM

 

a kinetics model for a molecular scale, and than i was going to use DWSIM for the industrial scale

 

What for? I was taught that mass transfer kinetic is able to be obtained by lab measurement only. As per my experience with unstudied material a good starting point is the Aspen+ feature "draw molecule" - see zip attached.

 

You believe that obtaining a kinetic provides you some help in modelling of solids processing, correct? 

My idea is whether you will have a kinetic or not this changes nothing in process modelling such kind of. Do you believe one can create a credible model by putting in a flowsheet an extractor block? Or is this model intended for a presentation purpose only to impress the boardmembers and has nothing to do with a future pilot plant?

 

for info

https://www.shi-pe.s...cture/basic008/

 

the latter is the situation. I know it seems a bit odd, but straight up i'm dealing with some functionally illiterate people who believe that because they pay for it, their opinion is more important than someone who went to school for this and has practical experience. instead of continuing this back handed game of politics, i'm going to try to instead be undeniable. but i can't do that unless i have either real or digital results to show. cant have real results when they're the ones calling the shots and don't take failure as a sign.

 

either way, having a model that can generate an animation akin to protein docking would be helpful.



#8 shvet1

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Posted 09 July 2024 - 11:07 PM

the latter is the situation.  

 

In this case I recommend use Apen+ built-in features. Those are able to provide "good-looking" results with little efforts from a user.

I am familiar with SimSci and Aspen products families only, I guess similar features might present in other simulators also.






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