11 replies to this topic

[Sahar]

I need to solve the problem with the regular blockage on flare K.O. Drum outlet line which caused by sludge. Currently we flush the Blowdown pump's suction line with water (BD pumps are intermittent). But it does not help that much. I was thinking about giving 1:100 slope to the K.O. Drum and also apply the mudwash process which is used in desalters.
Has anyone faced the same problem?
Any practical solution?

[Saml]

Why do you have mud/sludge in the flare knock out drum?

The outlet line you mention is the liquid line to the pump? or the main gas line?

What line are you goint to slope?

[fallah]

Hi Saha

 

I need to solve the problem with the regular blockage on flare K.O. Drum outlet line which caused by sludge. Currently we flush the Blowdown pump's suction line with water (BD pumps are intermittent). But it does not help that much. I was thinking about giving 1:100 slope to the K.O. Drum and also apply the mudwash process which is used in desalters.
Has anyone faced the same problem?
Any practical solution?

Hi Sahar,

 

Mudwash process may not be applied to KOD cleaning as the KOD pumps are intermittent in operation, hence the sludge can accumulate in KOD bottom and pump suction line in lack of recycling from stopped pump, and also the sludge in KOD which is mostly polymeric is inherently different than the mud which is mostly comprised of minerals.

 

Sloping the KOD and simultaneous extending the suction line inside the drum (but lower than LL liquid level) can improve the conditions in which you have to drain periodically the lower end of the drum to remove the accumulated sludge...

[Sahar]

Hi Saha

 

I need to solve the problem with the regular blockage on flare K.O. Drum outlet line which caused by sludge. Currently we flush the Blowdown pump's suction line with water (BD pumps are intermittent). But it does not help that much. I was thinking about giving 1:100 slope to the K.O. Drum and also apply the mudwash process which is used in desalters.
Has anyone faced the same problem?
Any practical solution?

Hi Sahar,

 

Mudwash process may not be applied to KOD cleaning as the KOD pumps are intermittent in operation, hence the sludge can accumulate in KOD bottom and pump suction line in lack of recycling from stopped pump, and also the sludge in KOD which is mostly polymeric is inherently different than the mud which is mostly comprised of minerals.

 

Sloping the KOD and simultaneous extending the suction line inside the drum (but lower than LL liquid level) can improve the conditions in which you have to drain periodically the lower end of the drum to remove the accumulated sludge...

 

Hi Naser,

I liked the opinion of extending the suction line inside the drum. the sludge in the KO drum is because of scale and rust you have on lines which are not permanently in service, such as PSV lines. the sludge are much lighter than those in desalters. since the pumps are intermittent, I can either of them just for circulating and floating the sludge to prevent them from aggregating and accumulating. this process can be done time to time, once a week or even continuously.

however giving slope and extending the suction line inside the drum seems practical!

I have to also consider cost impacts in to account for both solution.

thanks
 

[Sahar]

Hi Saha

 

I need to solve the problem with the regular blockage on flare K.O. Drum outlet line which caused by sludge. Currently we flush the Blowdown pump's suction line with water (BD pumps are intermittent). But it does not help that much. I was thinking about giving 1:100 slope to the K.O. Drum and also apply the mudwash process which is used in desalters.
Has anyone faced the same problem?
Any practical solution?

Hi Sahar,

 

Mudwash process may not be applied to KOD cleaning as the KOD pumps are intermittent in operation, hence the sludge can accumulate in KOD bottom and pump suction line in lack of recycling from stopped pump, and also the sludge in KOD which is mostly polymeric is inherently different than the mud which is mostly comprised of minerals.

 

Sloping the KOD and simultaneous extending the suction line inside the drum (but lower than LL liquid level) can improve the conditions in which you have to drain periodically the lower end of the drum to remove the accumulated sludge...

 

[Sahar]

 

Hi Saha

 

I need to solve the problem with the regular blockage on flare K.O. Drum outlet line which caused by sludge. Currently we flush the Blowdown pump's suction line with water (BD pumps are intermittent). But it does not help that much. I was thinking about giving 1:100 slope to the K.O. Drum and also apply the mudwash process which is used in desalters.
Has anyone faced the same problem?
Any practical solution?

Hi Sahar,

 

Mudwash process may not be applied to KOD cleaning as the KOD pumps are intermittent in operation, hence the sludge can accumulate in KOD bottom and pump suction line in lack of recycling from stopped pump, and also the sludge in KOD which is mostly polymeric is inherently different than the mud which is mostly comprised of minerals.

 

Sloping the KOD and simultaneous extending the suction line inside the drum (but lower than LL liquid level) can improve the conditions in which you have to drain periodically the lower end of the drum to remove the accumulated sludge...

 

Hi Naser,

I liked the opinion of extending the suction line inside the drum. the sludge in the KO drum is because of scale and rust you have on lines which are not permanently in service, such as PSV lines. the sludge are much lighter than those in desalters. since the pumps are intermittent, I can either of them just for circulating and floating the sludge to prevent them from aggregating and accumulating. this process can be done time to time, once a week or even continuously.

however giving slope and extending the suction line inside the drum seems practical!

I have to also consider cost impacts in to account for both solution.

thanks

besides, I need to recheck the sizing of the KOD. extending will change the LLLL and all residence time
 

 

 

[Sahar]

Why do you have mud/sludge in the flare knock out drum?

The outlet line you mention is the liquid line to the pump? or the main gas line?

What line are you goint to slope?

 

Saml,

the sludge formed at the bottom of the KOD and block the liquid line. the reason is rust and scale deposit in the line routed to flare.

by slope, I meant giving slope to the drum, not to the line.

[Saml]

 

Why do you have mud/sludge in the flare knock out drum?

The outlet line you mention is the liquid line to the pump? or the main gas line?

What line are you goint to slope?

 

Saml,

the sludge formed at the bottom of the KOD and block the liquid line. the reason is rust and scale deposit in the line routed to flare.

by slope, I meant giving slope to the drum, not to the line.

 

 

Thanks, I understood the meaning after Fallah post (A very good one)

May I add that in API 521 (5.9 b in version 2014) the following is stated: "Internally extended liquid outlet nozzles should be used so sediment settles out in the drums, not in low spots in the line".

[Sahar]

 

 

Why do you have mud/sludge in the flare knock out drum?

The outlet line you mention is the liquid line to the pump? or the main gas line?

What line are you goint to slope?

 

Saml,

the sludge formed at the bottom of the KOD and block the liquid line. the reason is rust and scale deposit in the line routed to flare.

by slope, I meant giving slope to the drum, not to the line.

 

 

Thanks, I understood the meaning after Fallah post (A very good one)

May I add that in API 521 (5.9 b in version 2014) the following is stated: "Internally extended liquid outlet nozzles should be used so sediment settles out in the drums, not in low spots in the line".

 

Yes Saml. I found that statement in API 521. in fact I figured out that the liquid outlet nozzle has been already extended 4" into the drum. and the LLL where the pump stops is 1'. i.e.above the extended nozzle. the current sludge problems shows that the level of sludge has been increased in the system (more than 4"). so we can either extend it more which costs a lot in an existing plant and may affect the drum sizing, cause it changes the LLL and other levels correspondingly; or we can use the mud wash process, by putting the spare pump in service permanently with lower flow rate, for recycling and making turbulence in the drum to prevent sludge aggregation.

 

[Adodic1]

Can you take a sample and determine what the material is and then work backward to reduce or eliminate the source?

 

Al

[Sahar]

Can you take a sample and determine what the material is and then work backward to reduce or eliminate the source?

 

Al

yes Adodic, I'll definitely do so. but figuring out the problem and solve the source takes long time ( maybe about 10 years). so I need to solve the downstream for this period.

[Adodic1]

I am referring to the simplest of samples that would allow you to determine one or more sources of the material and I can't imagine how that would take 10 years to study and resolve.

 

Alex