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4

Diked Area Volume According To En

lpg; basi; sewer

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#1 reihane1

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 08:08 AM

Hello everybody,

 

We have some Spherical LPG storage tanks which are connected to 3 different remote pounding basins. Unfortunately the plant is old and we could not find design basis for basins. Because of change in  regulations in germany, LPG considered  hazardous to water and we need to cover the surface of basin with betone. My questions are:

 

1- Is there any EN or german regulation which describe how the volume of the basin shall be calculated ( I have seen in other posts people refering to API2510 but it is an american standard and we need to design according to european standard)

 

2- how this system shall be connected to waste water system to drain rainwater/firewater/foam? is it enough to conect it to sewer system with a water barrier and gas sensor ?

Many thanks

Rayhan


Edited by reihane1, 09 July 2019 - 08:14 AM.


#2 PhilippM

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 12:20 PM

I don't think LPG is considered hazardous to water. Do you have the SDB ("Sicherheitsdatenblatt", German for MSDS) that gives you the WGK ("Wassergefährdungsklasse", Water hazard class)?



#3 reihane1

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 12:24 AM

I have just checked MSDS.It is WGK3. Maybe it is good to mention that the composition is more C4 than C3. Do you know if there is a German or European Norm for design of basin?I could not find anything.

Thanks

Rayhaneh



#4 PhilippM

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 01:34 PM

I still highly doubt that LPG is a WGK 3 substance. All sources that I found say that it is "nwg" (nicht wassergefährdend, not hazardous to water) as it evaporates under atmospheric conditions and therefore cannot enter the groundwater. You should really check if this MSDS is the correct one (can you upload it here?).

 

But for the sake of argument let's say it is indeed hazardous to water:

You should look in the following laws and standards:

-WHG

-AwSV

-TRGS 509

-TRBS 3146/TRGS 746

-TRws DWA-A 779

-TRwS DWA-A 785

-LöRüRL



#5 reihane1

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 06:19 AM

Hi Philipp

Thank you very much for your answer. The reason why our LPG has WGK 3 is Butadiene. But apart from that because of foam (WGK 3) which we use in case of leakage in summer, basin should be conform to AwSV.

I have checked TRGS 509 which says how the volume of basin shall be calculated but unfortanutely is only for Liquids.TRGS 746 also is not clear about the volume of basin.At the end I think we need to define a scenario to determine maximu volume of LPG released in case of leakage.

Regards

Rayhaneh



#6 breizh

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 07:55 AM

Hi ,

I've been using butadiene at the site I've been  in charge ( latex production) in Indonesia . The material was stored either in sphere or bullet . I do remember a bund around the storage for collecting and recycling water sprayed on the top of the storage in case of high temperature (worst case fire ).

I've attached a document about this chemical where you may find pointers .

In any case the chemical will be released as a gas at atmosphere pressure in case of leak..

Good luck.

Breizh

Attached Files


Edited by breizh, 16 July 2019 - 08:34 PM.


#7 PhilippM

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 02:54 PM

Do you maybe have access to the Brandschutzgutachten (fire protection report) ?



#8 reihane1

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Posted 24 July 2019 - 11:16 AM

Philipp we are working exactly on Brandschutzbedarfsplanung (Fire protection report).  






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